Are You Pop Paleo or Deep Paleo? Read this to find out.

This Post Has 47 Comments

1. Dr. Cate,

   Regarding oxidation and the concept of inflamation, you have noted that more so than omega 6 content in the diet, oxidation of ingested PUFAs is more critical. How does this align with the omega 6 / omega 3 ratio that many in the paleo community try to monitor? So many times I read that we should all be reducing our omega 6 load and/or megadose on omega 3 to balance the ratio.

   Can you share your opinion? Thanks.

   1. Omega 6 and 3 are both essential fats. With all the emphasis on omega-3 we lose sight of the fact that we still need both. The main reason people get into trouble with too much 6 and not enough 3 has to do with the fact that on a typical diet you will get 6 in vegetable oils and 3 almost nowhere.

2. OK! Here we go:

   How many of you would be willing to send a letter or email to one or more restaurants that you love if Dr. Cate goes to the trouble of writing a template for us? Let’s start this campaign now!! 🙂

   1. You can set up causes on facebook, that may help get the ball rolling.

   2. I’m in!

      Maybe the local Weston Price Foundation chapters would be interested in helping band together people too? They’ve already got an organized following and the mutural dislike of veggie oils.

      But first, Facebook!

3. I just found out that one of my favorite restaurants uses Canola Oil. I’d like to send the owner and chef an email urging them to discontinue its use. Would you be able to put together a template email or letter that all of us in the Paleo/Primal/Ancestral community could use to send to restaurants? If it could include links to many substantiating articles, (including from any mainstream medical journals, if you can find any), that would help make the email so much more powerful.

   I could try to do write such an email on my own, but I know the arguments would be sloppy and ineffective. If you could put this together for us, we could start a huge campaign of educating chefs and restaurant owners!

   Thank you so much for considering this request and for all the great work you do.

   1. Okay you just volunteered yourself. Get your campaign going and once you’ve got the followers I will write the letter!

4. What are your thoughts on Blood Types and diets? I follow more of the deep paleo, because I’m type O. My acupuncturist tells me my Type A children should not eat that much meat or fat as me. Your thoughts? I also am having such a hard time losing weight when i don’t keep track of calories – it’s easy to overdo calories when you eat a lot of steak, whole milk and butter!

5. So..did you find any restaurants in Austin that fit the bill? I live here, and would love to know of anyone NOT using these horrible oils. Thanks.

   1. I ate at TRACE but had to make the usual special requests, unfortunately. And since they had no idea, they used no oil whatsoever, so it was a little weird.

6. I am definitely deep paleo. A slight aside, but important for people who want to promote organic, heirloom vegetables: the spread of canola growing threatens heirloom seed production in the northwest – a primary source of heirloom vegetable seeds, as discussed by a concerned grower of heirloom seeds, here: http://crew.wildgardenseed.com/2013/02/20/canola-comment-september-28-2012/

7. Awesome article! I have a few coworkers who are hardcore Paleo but eat tons of these PUFAs. They thought I was *insane* for my Kerrygold butter use and how much olive oil/coconut oil I use. And my goodness, if you don’t do Crossfit around here don’t dare call yourself Paleo. Funny what we do when we start labeling and putting ourselves into groups. I just tell people I am a real food eater. If they want to know more, I am happy to answer questions.

8. I think the only piece that I have a question about is the part about peanut oil. Many people have digestive issues caused by peanuts and should exclude them from their diets. Rather than promoting peanut oil as a “safe” oil…aren’t their better sources from which to get healthy omega-6 levels? Like, eating local, free-range eggs, free-range turkey and other grass-fed meat, or by simply cooking in pastured butter? Or, am I confused? I don’t understand why peanut oil would be one that would be okay…considering that peanuts cause such problems for so many people, both allergy related and digestion.

   I am not trying to argue or offend anyone…just posing the question, because I am far from being an expert…there is just SO much information out there, it can be overwhelming.

   1. We don’t want to advise restriction to people who don’t have issues and keep in mind that many people have allergies to eggs and seafood. It’s difficult enough to get good nutrition these days!

9. I was doing well until the “dairy” question. I have tried every way imaginable to incorporate at least a small amount of high-quality dairy into my diet, from either cows or goats, to no avail. It affects my lower GI tract in some way that I don’t really understand, and it takes weeks to fully recover after testing a dairy-containing food. I finally eliminated even pasture butter and ghee, although I do eventually intend to test them again. Maybe.

   I was one of those people that didn’t have any obvious problem with dairy until after going paleo and dairy-free for an extended period of time. I don’t know what happened, and while I have heard similar stories from others, I haven’t come across a good, solid, objective explanation.

10. Thanks Dr. Cate. Big fan, here. Thank you for clarifying WHY Canola is bad for you (oxidation v. omega 6 content).

    It seems everything has canola in it these days, and waiters and cooks seem to gleam when announcing that they only use canola oil, like they are being so healthy. When I eat lunch out, I try and visit a whole foods type salad bar. It seems all the hot food has canola as an ingredient, I usually have to skip the hot items (and sometimes hunger says eff it, and I serve a portion of it, soooo bad!).

    In the past year I switched to using only coconut oil (deelish) and butter (more deelish!) when cooking at home and even skip the olive oil (nasty flavor).

    As far as the Deep Paleo questions?? I am proud to say, that I read your book DN about a a year ago (still one of my favorites) and I answered yes to 4 out of the 5 questions. I still have a hard time saying no to cooked bacon, no matter what the source. However, when I purchase it, its always uncured bacon usually from Trader Joes, so yummy!

    Hope to hear you one day in person, maybe at Paleo F/X 2014?? Hahah, one can dream/plan.

    Thanks for all you Dr. Cate.

    1. It’s the oxidation, not the omega 6 content. We have a chapter called Good Fats and Bad in Chapter 8 of Deep Nutrition that will help you understand the profound effects of oxidation on tissues of the body.

11. Dr Cate

    Since really trying to go deep into nutrition I have been experiencing more “flare ups” of gout. Because of the meds I am on because of cardio-myopathy and a-fib, I am sure they have screwed up my blood. But is this frequency of pain an attempt by my body to adapt to the new diet? I love the plan, I actually enjoy the food more. We are only using Olive and Coconut oil in our house.

    Thank you
    Dave

    1. Sounds like you would benefit from a visit with one of the Paleo Docs or other doctors listed on the link here https://drcate.com/make-an-appointment-with-dr-cate/

       And make sure to drink plenty of water.

12. Dr. Cate,

    Great article. Now, to refresh myself, is it the high amount of PUFA in canola that makes it unstable for cooking?

    Also, I am going to begin my medical school journey this fall at the University of Louisville, but would love to end up in California. Do you know of any residency programs (preferably internal medicine) in coastal California that do not adhere strictly to conventional wisdom, but rather teach principles more in line to those of yourself?

    Thanks!

    Tyler

    1. We go into the details in Chapter 8 of DN, and yes it’s the PUFA.
       No idea on residency programs.

13. Dr. Cate, do you have any tips for typical items you can eat out or choices one can make that have the best chance of being canola free? I eat most of my meals at home, but I don’t like the idea of having to avoid eating out all together–what fun is that. Thank you for an interesting post.

    1. They can add Canola to everything. I ask “is there anything on your menu that can be made without Canola.” Often, they have to whip out some olive oil and make a grill item special.

14. My body is the barometer of oils! When I eat an oil, such as a seed oil, I get the deepest ache in my gall bladder meridian (outside of my thigh) on the side I am sleeping on. It took me ages to work it out why I would sometimes have it and sometimes not, but then I realized it was every time I ate outside the home.
    Sure stopped me eating out!

    I am in Italy at the moment and thankfully I can eat everything that the restaurants serve (the meat and vege bits anyway, not the pasta or pizza!)

    I went to Spain last year and although they cook with olive oil, the olive oil is so contaminated with other oils that I couldn’t go out to eat and had to cook everything myself. Such a pity!

    I believe I am like a canary in the coal mine. I will be the one to feel it in my body when there is not something right in the food. It’s a gift and it’s hard to bear sometimes.

    Olive oil even in Italy is contaminated, but the restaurants always get their oils from places they can trust. I can only hope that they continue to do so.

15. You go girl. Good job, Dr. Kate. I love your attitude. You are a born teacher!!! Love you.

16. I got the Canola oil thing from “Deep Nutrition”. But I’ve heard & read some things about supposed olive oil, labelled as EV and all, that make me wonder how trustworthy it is – even actually canola and perfumed to smell/taste like olive oil. What do you know about this? The recommendation from these sources is to limit oneself to California olive oil, presumably because we have better regulation of the industry and producers than they have in Italy, Spain, Greece, etc. But, really??? Should I be concerned about olive oil?

    1. I’m not. As long as it tastes a lot like olive oil, that’s good ‘nuf.
       One of the problems raised about olive oil is they ‘dope’ olive oil with hazelnut. But that’s more of a culinary problem than a health problem because hazelnut is also a fine oil for cooking though not as popular for whatever reason so it fetches a lower price.

17. Hi Dr. Cate,
    Thank you. I found the article so useful as a newbie to paleo (former decade long vegan). On a regular basis I’m now emailing restaurants inquiring whether their fish is farmed or wild caught, meat is grass fed/finished, and is the poultry pastured. I never thought to inquire about the canola oil although in the back of my mind I knew I should – I’ve asked about it in the past but lately I’ve forgotten! Thank you for such a big reminder. I will no longer forget. Job well done.

18. Just want to mention that if you eat at any large health food chain, everything has canola oil in it. They all use lot’s of it. Other less mentioned things on my to be avoided lists, that are in many foods eaten by paleo folks are xantham gum and guar gym, both of which can be gut irritants.
    Thanks, great work, as always.

19. PS..I’m Deep Paleo, of course!

20. Rock on, Cave Girl…ROCK ON!

    1. Hi Kim!! I miss Hooksett’s best health food market and funnest Marketteer!

21. Thanks, Dr. Cate! Deep Nutrition opened my eyes to the canola threat. I thought I was doing such a good thing to use organic (non-GMO) Canola and was kicking myself (right to the olive oil aisle) once I got the correct info. Your work has changed my life!

22. I have been thinking of myself as “Primal” (think Mark Sisson primal blueprint) these past 2 1/2 years and he is a noncanola oil person too.

    I find that my body has a harder time with canola and most vegetable oils than it does with Gluten. I have a hard time going out to eat anything. The oils are much more inflammatory to my system than anything else.
    Breakfast seems easier since I can ask for eggs fried in butter please.

    When I try explain to people that I do not eat vegetable oils their eyes glaze over. Most folks are much more knowledgeable about gluten these days.

23. One more question: Would it be fair to conclude that all seed oils are bad and nut oils are good? I realize peanuts are legumes so they’re in a different category altogether.

    1. Its about the processing. You can get poor quality olive oil and high quality grapeseed. So I guess I could rephrase, that: It’s really about how much you are paying. If you have to pay more, it’s probably b/c the manufacturer is doing it right.

       1. OK. Thank you. It’s shameful that the only way we can figure out how an oil has been processed is by making an assumption based on the price! It sounds like we need the oil manufacturers to show some kind of symbol or label that indicates how the oils were processed. Should we complain to the FDA about this?

          1. Yes! I think that’s a superb idea!

             However, while in my opinion these oils are responsible for a huge portion of chronic disease burden in the US and a recent study showed that PUFA consumption is not as healthy as once believed (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23386268), the USDA and FDA probably are still of the mind that PUFAs are “the good kind of fat”

24. This is a really great post, Dr. Cate. Thank you so much for making this distinction between Pop Paleo and Deep Paleo. I now realize that I need to be much more careful at restaurants! Regarding canola oil-use at restaurants, do you think it would ever be used for sauteeing vegetables or meat? I thought I was avoiding bad oils by avoiding french fries and other fried foods but do you think any restaurant would use canola oil to saute meat or veggies? I would think it wouldn’t taste good but, who knows, maybe they use it because it’s cheap. Also, I often eat bacon at restaurants but have never asked if it came from a humanely-rasied animal. I’ll start asking!

    1. Oh yes, they do use Canola in EVERYTHING. This is a big BIG secret of the restaurant industry. You will be shocked once you start asking.

       Ask about “blended” oils too, which are mostly canola/soy and only a small percent is olive. It’s shameful what’s going on behind kitchen doors in some restaurants.

       Those who are doing it right deserve to be recognized!

       1. Depressing! But if we all start asking, then chefs will start to realize that there are a lot of us who demand better. Grassroots efforts are sometimes the most effective!

       2. I was once told by an employee at Red Lobster that they coat ALL their seafood in soybean oil. GMO, no doubt. Yuck.

25. Dr. Cate, this is another excellent distinction from a leader in the field: you. Bringing the science back to medicine again!

26. Rather, that would be “more paleo than thou.” Darn you autocorrect.

27. Pop paleo vs deep paleo? Do we really need more labels to beat each other up with in playing more paleo than though? I understand where you are coming from here, I just don’t think adding new terminology or levels or whatever else you might want to call it is particularly helpful to the community.

    1. Andrea we don’t want to divide either !! but the fact is this message needs to be heard and so if you have a better suggestion as to how to wake people up to this extremely important and almost universally overlooked issue (by patients coming to me doing “Paleo”), I’m all ears!

       This article, though, is not about who is MORE Paleo, but about the fact that there are those who GET Paleo better than others and those who get it good could provide guidance to others on this particular point. I was hoping that would come across but, alas, no, so now I get to point it out. Thank you!

    2. And it is not really “beating anyone up” to say that consuming gluten has certain potential consequences- or consuming canola oil. But if Dr. Cate is saying that eating large amounts of Canola oil is simply NOT PALEO, then that can be our accepted dividing boundary: PALEO or NOT PALEO. I am a word guy and every new category in language adds to precision. So, Andrea, if you want to call canola-heavy diets “semi-paleo,” then I figure Dr. Cate can go with that. But as far as writing blogs and making up headlines, the graphic is cute and the headline is fine with me. It got you and me to read the article, right?

Comments are closed.

Note: Please do not share personal information with a medical question in our comment section. Comments containing this content will be deleted due to HIPAA regulations.